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Who has the Curtis Sparks Advanced Timing Key?
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Posted by: FoxHondaRider

Who here has the Curtis Sparks Advanced timing key? Did anyone ever have a problem with running it? I know it creates more heat but how much? Anyone have it where their quad starts to ping? I want to do this mod and I have looked into it before but now i'm really going to get it. I hear its a pretty good gain.

Posted by: DementeD

i cant say anythingyet..other then its sittin on my desk waitin for installation..

gotta go get the gasket+oil+filter+exhaust gaskets(since i recently removed the header to grind down the welds which were OMG on the left side and wrapped it with the heat shield which works GREAT)

so hopefully this week ill run down to my local honda store n pick that stuff up and get to working on the beast ...and as soon as i get it running ill through out my feed back..

Posted by: FoxHondaRider

yeah i was grinding the welds on my header last weekend. Theyw erent that bad actually. The 1 side was almost perfect. Goes to show how different Honda's can be. Head ports and welds are never the same. I did very little grinding on my welds. Let me know how everything works out for you. I am trying to tally up how much its going to cost me gaskets and all

Posted by: DementeD

ya definitely more then i first figured..
as far as my welds..if ur sittin on the quad..the right side was pretty good..spent about 5-6 mins on that side..the left however i spent at least a half hour on it..burnt the **** out of my self too..

its like when they were welding it together the metal was dripping and blocking like atleast 1/4 of the exhaust maybe more..so i was grinding that down forever..that was the first side i noticed when i took it off and iwas like holy **** no wonder people grind this down...then the other wise was very good but still could handle some grinding..

i think i may also ride my bike a little longer..actually use the oil i just put in it like last week..

Posted by: dang400ex

I have the Cs adv timing key on my 02 400ex. It was the cheapest power I've bought. Makes it run great, idle is better, very torquey. All i spent on the whole installation was $16 for the gasket and $20 for the key and puller. I didnt drain any oil!!?

Posted by: jrdrag5475

what are you guys grinding down? or what is it for? I was thinking about getting the adv timing key, is there anyone else who can give any other input? Anything to watch for?

Posted by: Ntensweapon

why don't you guys just put a new cdi on?

Posted by: DementeD

i believe the key is better then a new cdi..

grinding is referring to the header nothing to do with the key

and u dont have to drain the oil u could prop the rear tire up but imma need an oil change soon so imma just go ahead n do it..

Posted by: DementeD

well i went to get my gasket today and ..of course none in stock..

so i guess ill report back around monday or tuesday if all goes well

Posted by: REDRIDDER

I ran a sparks degree key before i went with the 426 kit.The key is worth every penny and it does make your quad get a little hotter but not exactly sure how much but other than that you'll notice a difference in the low end for sure, it will make it stand up easier and the throttle response is much crispier than stock ever was or will be. best bang for your buck but if i were you Foxhondarider id save up a little more and just buy the monster super coil its about the same gains but works really well down low and keeps working even after that,it will give you a better burn,hotter spark ect I'm sure you've heard of this.I just bought one about a month or so ago and love it.

Posted by: DementeD

im sure that coil is compatible with the key though right??

Posted by: REDRIDDER

quote:
Originally posted by DementeD
im sure that coil is compatible with the key though right??

Not sure if i personaly would run both, what i meant was to save up and get the best of both worlds and buy the monster coil.

Posted by: hondaking52

i have the key with my hmf slip'on, its like a whole new bike, didnt cost me tht much for the whole thing, gaskets were like the same price as the key, and u can run the key and cdi, or key and coil if you wanted to...just gonna cost ya more $$$$$, but i'm VERY happy with just the key/pipe(jetted,filter)

Posted by: FoxHondaRider

I hear about the monster coil but it cost more. and you say low end more torquey with the key so does it improve the whole RPM range or just low end?

Posted by: hungus07trx400

this is probably a dumb question but when you put the advanced timing key in do you have to change your jetting again?

Posted by: steffen_ex

you can use the coil with the rev box cant you?

Posted by: BlasterEaten250

I heard they don't mix well with higher compression engines. I have a wiseco 10:1 piston with an xr400 head gasket, is that still low enough for the key? Or would it make it oveheat really fast?

Posted by: hondaking52

they recomend you dont run the key with a high comp piston because it will reduce engine life and run much hotter, and you can run both together, my bud has the key and a cdi and his runs fine...and the rev box and coil will work better together..

Posted by: bearair

I think 10:1 is the limit Curtis Sparks sets for the key.

I've noticed much improved throttle response after putting mine in. I did several mods one after the other and ended up jetting for everything overall. I'm very happy with the outcome. Ended up with a 146 Dynojet main jet and 40 pilot. Plug stays clean and throttle response is crisp from idle on up to the rev limiter. No bogs, no stumbling. I can literally idle around while following my wife, or tap the throttle and have immediate thrust. I'm going to leave the motor alone except for maintenance until the warranty expires.

Posted by: FoxHondaRider

My neighbor which is big into racing, he owns cars and manages his son racing in NASCAR. He knows so much about engines and any part you could imagine. He is actually thinking of going into the ATV industry. Anyways I asked him about advancing the timing. He said Curtis Sparks has everything already figured out and it perfectly safe to run. Advancing the timing on race cars is a huge thing. Thats where they tune and get more out of their motors. They go much further obviously pushing the timing to as far as the engine will run good on. He said yes it will increase heat because advancing the timing makes it run lean which running lean means more HP. As for higher compression pistons, I think if you just had a bigger jet and higher octane fuel it would run fine or at least I would think. 10:1 compression is not a huge difference from stock compression wise. You get a lot more power obviously but it isnt anything rediculous. I would try calling curtis sparks and asking about that before I tried it. Another thing to add. Rev boxes typically have advanced timing. Problems occur with that due to being all electrical. What curtis sparks does is have the timing advanced to run perfectly and everything is set. Then they sell just a rev box that increases RPM's. Curtis Sparks knows what they are doing and they did that for a purpose. I do not have the need for more RPM at all all i'm looking to do is increase throttle response and power cheaply. And as for having a hotter spark sometimes a hotter spark will warp valves. Advancing the timing wll create more heat yes but it is just chnaging when the spark fires and not adding a hotter sprak or more intense spark. I looked into the monster coil and it seems like a good buy but for the price I rather save money on getting the timing key. Where is everyone ordering thei gaskets? Is the leftside case the only gasket you need or do you need a stator gasket too or something like that?

Posted by: DementeD

i believe its just the left side..i got mine from the local honda dealer..well i paid for it i get it monday ..it was like 15

Posted by: bearair

You need two gaskets unless you can get it apart without ripping one. The side cover gasket and the little starter cover gasket. The small cover has to be removed in order to get the side cover off. Both of mine came off in more than one piece so I was glad I'd ordered both gaskets. The little one was just a couple bucks extra. I order through bike bandit. They seem to discount 10-15% off of dealer prices for OEM gaskets. Sometimes a bit more on larger items.

And the main reason for the advanced timing is to have the cylinder pressure hit max at a better point in the combustion process. Advancing the timing doesn't change the mixture in any way. What it does do, is change the point when the mixture fires (obviously) so the flame front is more developed when the piston goes past TDC. This creates more power due to there being more "push" on the piston for a longer period of time. Also makes the engine more responsive. The factory timing is conservative to allow for fuel or heat issues. Advancing the timing creates more heat as the cylinder pressures are higher. Any time you create more pressure, you create more heat. On an otherwise stock engine, it's going to be well within the cooling system's ability to keep up with. I wouldn't worry about the heat issue.

Posted by: krt400ex

i running a timing key in mine. i noticed the biggest improvement was throttle response with some bottom end gains as well. it idled a little rougher though. i compensated fro that by turning my idle up slightly...was fine after that

Posted by: X400EX

I already bought the key 1 year ago. I'm still thinking about installing it, but if you look at my mods... I don't know.

Posted by: FoxHondaRider

quote:
Originally posted by X400EX
I already bought the key 1 year ago. I'm still thinking about installing it, but if you look at my mods... I don't know.

11:1 compression iw ould think is too high. call curtis sparks and ask them if you can run any compression higher than stock. If not then sell it. I'm looking to buy 1.

Posted by: FoxHondaRider

is there anyone that had to run a higher octane gas other than 92 or 93 after installing the key?

Posted by: hornetgod13

I ran 91 octane with the advance timing key installed. I e-mailed Curtis Sparks a while back when I went to a 11:1 416cc Piston. They told me that, big bore or higher compression pistons and their timing key do not mix well. I removed my advance timing key and sold it.

Posted by: FoxHondaRider

its a good mod though right? Is there an all around power gain or just bottom end?

Posted by: dang400ex

I would assume it is an allround power gain because it advances the timing which make the whole motor run a little faster. But you can sure feel the boost on the low end.

Posted by: sc400ex_rider

i have one and its sweet, i lightened my flywheel at the same time so its hard to pinpoint but its sweet. they seem to complement each other very well. when i bought mine i ask about the max compression. i told them it would be runnin 11 to 1 and they said its ok. to them high comp is 15 to 1. i kept my standard bore size to keep heat down. i run 93 pump gas. i have my stock cdi to keep the low rev limiter. i only tag it once in a while if i miss a shift or try to rev it out the hole. i think its a nice insurance policy. remember big bores make more heat, also a 440 piston weigh 60 gms or two onces more. then if your raise your rev limiter 1000 rpm that is alot more reciprocating mass (strain) on your crank and rod (boom)