[Honda TRX 700 XX vs. Raptor 700] - ATV Riders Forums - Honda, Yamaha, Suzuki, Kawasaki, Polaris, CanAm, Arctic Cat, Kymco ATVsPages:1
Honda TRX 700 XX vs. Raptor 700
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Posted by: yAmAhA-rIdEr155
Anyone that know's anything about the new Honda that thinks they can tell me something different besides the Raptor 700 being the best needs to say something.
Posted by: speedyquad
have you read any of the posts on the new 700xx...it has not been welcomed by even the hardest of honda fans...it is not an impressive quad...honda had their head up their you know whats with this one...
Posted by: yAmAhA-rIdEr155
nah i havent been to em yet
Posted by: bossman525
the raptor will eat that machine's lunch. i think it will be to slow to get out of even it's own way.
Posted by: WoofersInc
The Honda is coming with IRS rear end. It is also substantially heavier as the listed weight for it is 508 LBS. Unless power is up big time on the Honda there is no way it will keep up with the Raptor. The IRS rear doesn't impress me either. It is ok for slow technical stuff but for high speed desert riding or dunes it has it's drawbacks.
Posted by: redrocker
I think the honda eng. started working
at yamaha a few years back as you can
see by everything yamaha makes
it's too bad because I used to be
a honda guy
Posted by: jrwisehart
I really dont think you can compare them.
the raptor is built to be mainly a duner
the 700xx is suppose to be more of a trail bike
Posted by: yAmAhA-rIdEr155
thanks for the posts
Posted by: MoRaptor02
quote:
Originally posted by jrwisehart
I really dont think you can compare them.
the raptor is built to be mainly a duner
the 700xx is suppose to be more of a trail bike
WHAT??? The Raptor is the best trail bike ive owned. The Raptor was not built for the dunes. Who knows what that 700xx is suppose to be for.
Posted by: RaptorLover
I DON'T KNOW WHY I'M WASTING MY TIME POSTING ABOUT A HONDA , BUT HERE GOES ....
TRX700XX8 Metallic Black/Silver $7,899.00
Metallic Black/Red $7,899.00
The TRX700XX re-defines the Sport category of ATVs with a whole new level of confidence, comfort and high performance. With double-wishbone Independent Rear Suspension (IRS), a unique centered chain drive system, and a fuel-injected 686cc engine making monster torque, the TRX700XX is truly the new Sport ATV "King of the Hill."
Unique Features:
All-new 686cc SOHC liquid-cooled fuel-injected four-valve single-cylinder four-stroke engine.
Double-wishbone Independent Rear Suspension (IRS) with tuned sway-bar.
Centered chain final drive system.
In-gear starting in Forward or easy-to-use Reverse.
Piggy-back rear shocks with adjustable pre-load.
Dual-spring front shocks with adjustable pre-load.
11-inch diameter rear rims with removable mud scrapers.
Radical new-style bodywork.
Available colors are Metallic Black / Silver and Metallic Black / Red.
Engine/Drivetrain
686cc SOHC, four-stroke engine generates the highest peak output in its class.
Liquid cooling provides consistent engine operating temperature in extreme conditions for maximum power and long engine life.
PGM fuel injection system with 44mm throttle body for excellent cold weather starting, lower maintainance and consistent performance at high altitudes (seeTechnology Section).
Gear-driven counterbalancer minimizes engine vibration for smooth, comfortable all-day riding.
Maintenance-free automatic cam-chain tensioner.
Closed crankcase vent system safeguards against engine oil contamination.
CD ignition with electronic advance.
USDA-qualified stainless steel muffler/spark arrester for quiet operation and maximum power.
Heavy-duty clutch stands up to sport-ATV demands.
High-efficiency dry-sump lubrication system features large-capacity oil tank for maximum engine cooling.
Rugged five-speed transmission with Reverse has components and ratios specifically designed for sport-ATV use.
Unique, centered transmission with its direct-line chain final drive allows optimum IRS double-wishbone A-arm design
Chassis/Suspension
Independent double-wishbone front suspension uses premium shock absorbers featuring dual single-rate springs that allow a lighter, more compact package with 9.36 inches of fully useable travel.
Independent double-wishbone rear suspension, made possible by the innovative centered chain drive system - features steel upper and aluminum lower A-arms. Using piggy-back reservoir shocks, the system provides 10.6 inches of fully useable travel.
Steel frame with removable sub-frame is extremely durable and strong.
Triple disc brakes for excellent stopping power and weight savings.
Special, large-diameter 11-inch aluminum rear wheels allow for ideal CV joint angles and A-arm lengths, resulting in superior power delivery, optimum suspension action and improved durability.
Radial tires with knobby pattern provide superb traction and cornering ability.
Durable, heavy-duty O-ring-sealed drive chain.
Easy-to-use dual snail-cam eccentric chain adjusters
Additional Features
Engine design meets current California Air Resources Board (CARB) off-road emission standards.
Convenient push-button electric starting.
Sculpted, plush seat provides excellent comfort and superb sport riding ergonomics.
New and uniquely aggressive sports styling.
Cowl-integrated headlight with dual 30-watt bulbs provides distinctive sport style and excellent function
Rear LED brakelight.
Easy access to washable two-stage large-capacity foam air filter.
Tough, polyethelene push bar up front and polypropelene rear A-arm protectors.
High Impact urethane protects frame and engine cases..
Rear mudguards with rigid footrests.
8 AH Maintenance-free battery.
Keyed ignition switch offers added security.
Simple to operate multi-function handlebar switch.
Left-hand operated parking brake.
Tool kit includes tire-pressure air gauge and owner's manual.
Transferable one-year, limited warranty; extended coverage available with a Honda Protection Plan.
Purchase of a new, previously unregistered Honda USA-certified unit by an individual retail user in the United States qualifies the owner for a one-year complimentary membership in the Honda Rider's Club of America® (HRCA®). Visit www.hrca.honda.com for details.
Model: TRX700XX
Engine Type: 686cc liquid-cooled SOHC dry-sump single-cylinder four-stroke
Bore and Stroke: 102mm x 84mm
Induction: Keihin PGM-FI with a 44mm throttle-body fuel injection system
Ignition: CD with electronic advance
Starter: Electric
Clutch: Manual
Transmission: ESP five-speed with Reverse
Driveline: O-ring-sealed #520 chain
Suspension Front: Independent double-wishbone with dual single-rate springs provide 9.3 inches of travel.
Rear: Independent double-wishbone with piggy-back reservoir shocks provide 10.6 inches of travel
Brakes Front: Dual hydraulic 174 mm discs
Rear: Single hydraulic 200mm disc
Tires Front: 21 X 7R 10
Rear: 22 X 9R 11
Length: 73.9 inches
Width: 46.3 inches
Height: 45.4 inches
Seat Height: 33 inches
Ground Clearance: 10.5 inches
Wheelbase: 50.0 inches
Turning Radius: 8.5 feet
Fuel Capacity: 3 gallons
Colors: Metallic Black/Silver, Metallic Black / Red
Curb Weight*: 508 pounds
Posted by: RaptorLover
The TOPIC says Honda 700 vs. Raptor 700 , my opinion is that , the 700xx , wil be a waste of time and money , it's way to heavy , and I don't think it have nearly the power that the Yamaha have , IRS - We people here in South-Afrika don't really like IRS , if it was a solid rear axle it would have been a bit better.... BUT thats just all what I THINK .....
Posted by: speedyquad
quote:
Originally posted by RaptorLover
The TOPIC says Honda 700 vs. Raptor 700 , my opinion is that , the 700xx , wil be a waste of time and money , it's way to heavy , and I don't think it have nearly the power that the Yamaha have , IRS - We people here in South-Afrika don't really like IRS , if it was a solid rear axle it would have been a bit better.... BUT thats just all what I THINK .....
wow, in one post you have repeated what almost every one has said in other threads on this...even the die hard honda people agree with that. there is much disappointment about this new "great" atv. it is def. a let down
Posted by: roc64
quote:
Originally posted by jrwisehart
I really dont think you can compare them.
the raptor is built to be mainly a duner
the 700xx is suppose to be more of a trail bike
That may be the STUPIDEST statement I have ever heard anyone say about the Raptor!!!!
Get a clue!
Posted by: wolfpack13
No one here has rode it, or even seen the beast in person. How come so many can give a opinion with such little knowlege about the object?
Not trying to be an @$$ here but I don't really think that it was directed at the Raptor.
Posted by: speedyquad
quote:
Originally posted by wolfpack13
Not trying to be an @$$ here but I don't really think that it was directed at the Raptor.
that is why all of us honda guys hate it, we have been wanting something that is directed directly at the raptor, but instead honda gave us this tank.
between this adn the starting issues i have on my 450r. i can honestly say, i am no longer a die hard honda guy. i will consider and purchase another brand for my next quad. i have bought my last honda for a while
Posted by: yAmAhA-rIdEr155
i hate it also, they should work on the body stlye a little more
Posted by: cjkranz
and just FYI, the raptor 700R is a GREAT dune quad. Of all the atvs I have had over the years (>25) this is my favorite dune quad yet...
Posted by: yAmAhA-rIdEr155
raptor 700 wins by a long shot in my opinion
Posted by: rbgnwa45
Something that caught my eye was the high rear end ground clearance, this looks like a great trail quad! Don't come to any conclusions, even after the magazines review it. Wait till there are a few ride reviews! 21/front and 22/rear tires look nice too! Why would Honda copy the raptor? I'd like Honda to do it's own thing! The more I look at it the more I want it.
Posted by: pred174
Im pretty sure there is a new king of the hill and it isn't a honda or yamaha....
Posted by: atvRiDa400ex
quote:
Originally posted by pred174
Im pretty sure there is a new king of the hill and it isn't a honda or yamaha....
who?? polaris?? ktm?? maybe
Posted by: yAmAhA-rIdEr155
no one makes a better trail bike than honda or yamaha
Posted by: pred174
outlaw 525s, test drove one at the dealer a week ago and its got plenty more get up and go compared to 525irs...yeah the ktm will be faster but if your just gonna be riding the dunes you would be better off with the outlaw....u could put that 2k that u save towards bbk and put some shocks on it for that price
Posted by: 250r4life
quote:
Originally posted by pred174
outlaw 525s, test drove one at the dealer a week ago and its got plenty more get up and go compared to 525irs...yeah the ktm will be faster but if your just gonna be riding the dunes you would be better off with the outlaw....u could put that 2k that u save towards bbk and put some shocks on it for that price
oh brother...
Posted by: redrocker
They should have never stopped
building the atc 70!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: force
THE FRONT END BODY STYLING HAS TO BE THE UGLIEST/DUMBEST DESIGN EVER.
WHAT THE H*** IS THIS THING SUPPOSED TO BE? REMINDS ME OF THE POS VFORCE.
Posted by: QuadManiac
Don't go overboard with the weight issue... 700XX wieght is stated as fully wet, Raptor as fully dry. Real difference in weight is more like 50 lbs.
Posted by: TheNewn
quote:
Originally posted by QuadManiac
Don't go overboard with the weight issue... 700XX wieght is stated as fully wet, Raptor as fully dry. Real difference in weight is more like 50 lbs.
No kidding, everyone is going on and on about how much of a tank it is. They for some reason dont look at the little thing that says "curb weight" next to the number. Full fluids, full gas tank.
Its not *that* much heavier than the raptor, I'm sure it'll be a perfect quad for someone who rides woods a lot, with a lot of mud.
I'm sure it wont be that hard to ditch the ugly looking front end with something aftermarket as well. I think it has the potential to be a great quad.
*I* just wouldnt buy it. 
Posted by: speedyquad
but thin about it this way, who is mos tlikely going to be buying this big machine...the larger guy that might not fit as well on any other bikes. so before you even add in the 50 lbs(which really is a lot) of the bike, the rider may already be at an 50 or 70 lb disadvantage...
to my point, i am a smaller guy @ 152 lbs, a few of my friends who weigh significantly more than i do with essentially a twin bike(one was on a 400ex, and one is on a 450r/ltr450) would always lose in a drag race/distance race. they were somewhere between 80-100 lbs heavier. the only difference in the bikes being the brand of exhaust, every thing was almost exactly the same...
the bigger guy may not always be the one buying the bike, but it will be a good portion of the time
Posted by: MoRaptor02
My Raptor 700 is 480 curb weight. So theres not that much differance.
Posted by: QuadManiac
quote:
Originally posted by MoRaptor02
My Raptor 700 is 480 curb weight. So theres not that much differance.
BINGO!
Posted by: MoRaptor02
BINGO WHAT ???? Did I win something or what? LOL
Posted by: QuadManiac
You won the prize for logical thinking. It's not worth much though.
Posted by: MoRaptor02
Damn it. I thought I won something. Yeah I see people talking about the weight of different 4 wheelers, usually without saying anything. But you know Honda is making a run at the big bore yamaha finally. Im glad tehy are. I dont think its much of a run but its a start i guess. LOL
Posted by: FoxHondaRider
actually if you see the 700xx in different views or in action its really impressive. at 1st at the unveiling i though what is honda doing but once you see all angles its an 05-07 400ex plastics with almost a raptor grill sitting below. I think Honda needs to change a little bit but i look at it as honda made its 1st big bore sport qaud so give it time. Honda basically started sport quads with the 400ex and then the sport really grew with 4 strokes. As of now though I deffinately like the raptor way better. IRS doesnt impress me much and seems to take away the sporty look or thought of it IMO. Raptor is nice and alway has been.
Posted by: TheNewn
I'm sure the 700XX will be great for Woods/leisurely trail riding. Thats about it.
I'd say there's definitely a market for that kind of thing. Oh well, *I* wont buy it.
And Honda by no means 'started' sport quads with the 400EX. Believe it or not the 250R/Banshee/LT250 and others were around way before the 400ex ever was. Honda may have revitalized the sport industry, but they're falling behind now. In my opinion.
Posted by: laplap
quote:
Originally posted by MoRaptor02
My Raptor 700 is 480 curb weight. So theres not that much differance.
WHAT DO YOU HAVE 27 INCH TIRES OR SOMETHING? WET ITS NO MORE THEN 440 WITH HAND GAURDS/FULL SKIDS/GNCC'S
Posted by: MoRaptor02
No I just have dual LTE's, 20in Razr2 on baja rims on the rear. prm summit bumper and desert grab bar. Thats it. 480lbs. I didnt think it would weight that much either. But it did.
Posted by: QuadManiac
Honestly, how many ppl. besides Mo, have actually weighed thier rides?
Posted by: 250r4life
quote:
Originally posted by QuadManiac
Honestly, how many ppl. besides Mo, have actually weighed thier rides?
not many
Posted by: LotusPosition
480 lbs curb weight? I would seriously question the scale's accuracy.
Posted by: homer
480? With Razr2's and baja wheels I would figure it would be more like 500. I think ALOT of people would be suprised if they weighed their machine ready to run. So many people compare advertized weights like they are gospel and act like 10-20 pounds are going to make a big difference. I bet you could take 95% of the people on these forums, attach a 25 pound weight to the bottom of their quad without them knowing, and they wouldn't be able to tell a difference. The other 5% are pro's and they actually push their quads to the limit and they would be able to tell a difference, but still be able to ride it almost as fast.
The exception to this is of course drag racing and neither of these quads was ment for drag racing in stock form anyway.
Posted by: MoRaptor02
quote:
Originally posted by homer
480? With Razr2's and baja wheels I would figure it would be more like 500. I think ALOT of people would be suprised if they weighed their machine ready to run. So many people compare advertized weights like they are gospel and act like 10-20 pounds are going to make a big difference. I bet you could take 95% of the people on these forums, attach a 25 pound weight to the bottom of their quad without them knowing, and they wouldn't be able to tell a difference. The other 5% are pro's and they actually push their quads to the limit and they would be able to tell a difference, but still be able to ride it almost as fast.
The exception to this is of course drag racing and neither of these quads was ment for drag racing in stock form anyway.
You lose 1 hp for every 7 pounds. Thats why my fat *** doesnt drag race much. LOL
Posted by: QuadManiac
quote:
Originally posted by MoRaptor02
You lose 1 hp for every 7 pounds. Thats why my fat *** doesnt drag race much. LOL
What part of physics does this formula come from? I'm certainly unfamiliar with it, after a pretty good engineering education and career. Additional weight reduces acceleration and there's no direct relationship with power required unless you define either the straight line acceleration desired or the angle of the incline you must climb.
with the relationship, as described, at 7 lbs / hp... a semi-typical quad and rider at 550 lbs would be able to go nowhere without at least 78 hp. You're mixing apples and oranges.
Now, if you're implying that by adding 1 hp to the stock output, you can add 7 lbs and still accelerate at the same rate, there may well be some credence to that... In that case, my 250 lb lard butt is screwed, just like yours, lol, so ignore the rest of my statement!
Posted by: MoRaptor02
quote:
Originally posted by QuadManiac
What part of physics does this formula come from? I'm certainly unfamiliar with it, after a pretty good engineering education and career. Additional weight reduces acceleration and there's no direct relationship with power required unless you define either the straight line acceleration desired or the angle of the incline you must climb.
with the relationship, as described, at 7 lbs / hp... a semi-typical quad and rider at 550 lbs would be able to go nowhere without at least 78 hp. You're mixing apples and oranges.
Now, if you're implying that by adding 1 hp to the stock output, you can add 7 lbs and still accelerate at the same rate, there may well be some credence to that... In that case, my 250 lb lard butt is screwed, just like yours, lol, so ignore the rest of my statement!
Thats just what ive always heard 1hp per 7 pounds. Never really thought about it that much. But I do know That I can do anything I want to my Rappy 700 and im still not going to beat a 120 pounder on the same bike, or even a lower HP bike. But damn it I keep trying. LOL
Posted by: QuadManiac
We need to inhale a whole lot of helium.
Posted by: jesshamner
Honestly, I think Honda was trying to compete with the Renegade. They are both big bore sport/utility inspired trail quads with comfort and performance in mind. Emphasis on comfort.
Posted by: ATVX4
quote:
Originally posted by speedyquad
that is why all of us honda guys hate it, we have been wanting something that is directed directly at the raptor, but instead honda gave us this tank.
i can honestly say, i am no longer a die hard honda guy. i will consider and purchase another brand for my next quad. i have bought my last honda for a while
As a die hard honda guy also, I somewhat agree. I have rode sport quads my whole life. I have been waiting for Honda's answer to the Raptor, and I am not impressed. We wont even go into the issue of how it looks. That red/white/black SE raptor is SWEET!
However, At 43 years old and a lil overweight, It might be an ideal sport quad for me. A better ride, decent power, 5-speed. For now, I am going to wait untill it comes out and I hear some feedback about it. I just sold my 04 450R and I miss it. My 400ex as great as it is, is not cuttin it! Maybe a 416 kit and some shocks! LOL
Posted by: Ogener
quote:
Now, if you're implying that by adding 1 hp to the stock output, you can add 7 lbs and still accelerate at the same rate, there may well be some credence to that... In that case, my 250 lb lard butt is screwed, just like yours, lol, so ignore the rest of my statement!
I think thats what that statement means. If you lose 7lbs its like gaining 1hp ,you dont actually "gain" more hp but it feels like it. Or if you gain 7lbs you need 1hp to accelerate the same.
Posted by: #17YFZRACER
369.5lbs wet
take that 
Posted by: 07trx400ex
The Honda 700XX will be making 7 more hp than than the Raptor 700r.
Posted by: MadDog56
quote:
Originally posted by 07trx400ex
The Honda 700XX will be making 7 more hp than than the Raptor 700r.
And where does that number come from?
Posted by: RaptorLover
I still thing Raptor is better than the Honda , and will never buy the honda .... Raptor is a great quad , and I think Honda will need about 2 years or more to get the Honda to the same level as a Raptor or a Renegade !! My Opinion !
Posted by: TheNewn
quote:
Originally posted by RaptorLover
I still thing Raptor is better than the Honda , and will never buy the honda .... Raptor is a great quad , and I think Honda will need about 2 years or more to get the Honda to the same level as a Raptor or a Renegade !! My Opinion !
How do you know? It's not even released yet, for all anyone knows, it could blow the raptor/renegade out of the water.
And as for the other post, Where does the guy get his information from saying the 700xx will have 7 more hp than the raptor stock? I wave the BS flag on that, and if i had two of them, i'd wave them both.
Posted by: Evasiveone
quote:
Originally posted by TheNewn
And as for the other post, Where does the guy get his information from saying the 700xx will have 7 more hp than the raptor stock? I wave the BS flag on that, and if i had two of them, i'd wave them both.
He is basing this off of the California Air Resource Board numbers where they test the engines for California emmisions. The Raptor 700 is putting out 46.9 HP at the crank and the new 700xx is putting out 53 hp at the crank for a difference of 6.1 crank HP difference. The Rappy is running 9.1:1 compression and the 700xx is running 10.0:1 compression.
Posted by: reconranger
I couldn't take the time to read all the replies to this post, so excuse me if this has already been said.....
It is a mistake to compare these two machines! They are both 700cc....that is about all they have in common!!! Having IRS, puts the Honda in an entirely different class than the SRA Raptor....making it an apples vs oranges comparison.
The one thing the Honda has going for it is that it has a very high tech engine....along the lines of the current crop of 450's. It has a little slipper piston with low reciprocating weight...this isn't just a warmed over and bored out XR650 engine! This thing should really scream!!! It should be more of a rever, and not so much a torquer like the Raptor.
Personally, I don't have any need for IRS, and the machine is going to be 150 pounds heavier than my 450R....so it doesn't look very promising....at least not on paper.
Take this engine and put it in a light SRA frame (it would need a new bottom end, as the current engine is center-line drive), and I might be first in line.....
Posted by: TheNewn
The Raptor is made to be a great trail bike, the same intention that honda has for this 700xx i imagine. How are they not comparable? They are both made for the same thing, trails, which most people do. It wouldn't make sense to NOT compare two quads that were intended for the same general purpose.
Posted by: reconranger
An 800 pound utility is made for the "trails", so now we are going to say that thing is in the same class as the Raptor too????
You are certainly welcome to compare their performance out on the "trails"....uh once someone has actually ridden one...which noone has so far so we don't actually know what kind of quad it actually is....but nothing changes the fact that they are an apple and an orange!!!
Posted by: TheNewn
Without going to a stupid extreme, which seems to be popular, i'll try to explain myself further.
The 700xx IS a sport quad 2 wheel drive, chain drive, with IRS. Just like the Outlaw 525 IRS. Both are great (as far as i can tell in one case) attempts at creating a comfortable, fast trail quad.
The Raptor is designed to be a trail quad as well. Also a 2 wheel drive, chain driven sport quad. The Raptor and the XX have ONE key difference, IRS vs SRA. And if you're a fast trail rider looking for a nice sport quad they BOTH fall into the same category.
Just like people compare the Outlaw IRS's to the Raptor, i think the XX compares as well.
I wont even bother with the dumb 800 pound utility comment.
Posted by: reconranger
You know darn well that the point of the original post was some adolescent "Which Is Faster" kind of post...mostly I was reacting to the stupididy of that seeing absolutely nobody has ridden the Honda. All we are all doing is mental masterbation about what it looks like on paper....which doesn't mean much.
Got to say for what I ride, the machine looks like it will be useless and way to heavy...just like an IRS Outlaw, but at least that is an apples to apples comparison!
Posted by: MadDog56
Ahh good old reconranger, good to see you. On spec the machines are not in the same class, I agree with you 100% on that one. The 700xx matches up much better with the 525 outlaw.
But when someone starts shopping for a new trail quad, they're going to be comparing the 700R and the 700XX. The same guy is going to be looking at both machines and wondering "which should I buy?" So while your argument makes sense on paper, in the real world it is important how these two stack up against each other.
Posted by: reconranger
There is a replacement for displacement....and it is engine design!
May issue of DirtWheels, big bore shootout between the Raptor 700 and the 525's....dyno chart on page 58. The KTM525 absolutely kicks the Raptors butt:
Raptor- 41.4 max hp @ 6000 rpm...Raptor hp totally checks out early after that!
KTM- 44.6 max hp, but most important is that the KTM makes that horsepower at 8000 rpm....2000 rpm higher than the Raptor!!!
So what's my point here (besides making you Raptor owner's cringe)??? The Honda engine design is like the 450/525's: oversquare with a little slipper piston and low reciprocating weight. This engine isn't just a warmed over old school XR650 bored out a little. This engine is going to absolutely scream!!!
The problem I see for Honda, is that they put this engine in a rather heavy IRS frame that will probably have lots of body roll and is going to have limited specialized applications....like rutted eastern trails and rocky technical stuff (places where most folks are just going to ride a 4X4 instead!). No doubt as MadDog has pointed out, folks will buy it anyway just because of the number "700".....totally oblivious of the frame design.....
Posted by: MadDog56
Hey no doubt Honda will have built a great engine, just too bad that they're three quarters of a decade late to the big bore market. 
If they'd have stepped up and made an SRA version that was almost as good 5 years ago I'd be riding red right now.
Posted by: xrdrsux
what do you have maddog
Posted by: MadDog56
quote:
Originally posted by xrdrsux
what do you have maddog
Just an old beat up 2003 660 Raptor.
Posted by: TheNewn
quote:
Originally posted by reconranger
There is a replacement for displacement....and it is engine design!
May issue of DirtWheels, big bore shootout between the Raptor 700 and the 525's....dyno chart on page 58. The KTM525 absolutely kicks the Raptors butt:
Raptor- 41.4 max hp @ 6000 rpm...Raptor hp totally checks out early after that!
KTM- 44.6 max hp, but most important is that the KTM makes that horsepower at 8000 rpm....2000 rpm higher than the Raptor!!!
So what's my point here (besides making you Raptor owner's cringe)??? The Honda engine design is like the 450/525's: oversquare with a little slipper piston and low reciprocating weight. This engine isn't just a warmed over old school XR650 bored out a little. This engine is going to absolutely scream!!!
The problem I see for Honda, is that they put this engine in a rather heavy IRS frame that will probably have lots of body roll and is going to have limited specialized applications....like rutted eastern trails and rocky technical stuff (places where most folks are just going to ride a 4X4 instead!). No doubt as MadDog has pointed out, folks will buy it anyway just because of the number "700".....totally oblivious of the frame design.....
You ARE comparing an XC RACE bike to a TRAIL bike. The YFZ has almost as much power as the Raptor does stock as well, its a RACE bike. The Raptor's motor is capable of more power in the aftermarket than the KTM's.
The Raptor has lower compression, more restricted exhaust and intake, and a mild cam compared to the KTM.
You give both of them the Big 3, and the Raptor will make more power. with the lower compression and the mild cam.
Mad Dog made the perfect point i was trying to make. When people go shopping for a new big bore sport quad for fast trail riding, they're going to compare this new Honda to the Raptor.
It all comes down to how much it costs if its going to sell or not. People are buying the Outlaw's. They'll buy Honda's version of it if the price is right.
Posted by: xrdrsux
quote:
Originally posted by MadDog56
Just an old beat up 2003 660 Raptor.
do you have the 660R or the 660 RR
Posted by: reconranger
I have also always wondered why Honda didn't immediately put the XR650 engine in a quad......
But in retrospect, what would be the point when they already had the CRF450X on the drawing board. The 450's are beating the 650's in the big desert endurance races like Baja....so I now totally see what Honda's point was.....do more with less!!!!
It is clear that on the high preformance machines, Honda has put all its eggs in the little slipper piston basket....and they have carried this along to this 700.
Posted by: MadDog56
quote:
Originally posted by xrdrsux
do you have the 660R or the 660 RR
There is no 660RR, the only other model Yamaha ever released of the 660R was the LE models, which were identical to the regular models with the exception of a different color scheme and graphics.
Posted by: xrdrsux
Do you really want me to post the link of the 660 RR lmao
Posted by: MadDog56
quote:
Originally posted by xrdrsux
Do you really want me to post the link of the 660 RR lmao
The model is and always was the 660R. Each year had it's own designation after the first "R".
2001 was YFM660RN
2002 was YFM660RP
2003 was YFM660RR
2004 was YFM660RS
2005 was YFM660RT
LE models were YFM660RLE* where * was the yearly designation.
YAMAHA uses the same letter designation for ALL ATVS produced for that model year, the letter doesn't have anything to do with any type of different or special edition within the same year.
There were changes in the 2002, 2004 and 2005 model years. The 2003 is identical to the 2002 model with the exception of the color schemes.
Posted by: xrdrsux
?
Posted by: MadDog56
Nice try, but that old trick has been played out.
Guess this is what I get for trying to participate in an intelligent discussion on this board.
Posted by: xrdrsux
nope..just messin with ya MD. its been an epidemic.
Posted by: csr250r
quote:
Originally posted by FoxHondaRider
actually if you see the 700xx in different views or in action its really impressive. at 1st at the unveiling i though what is honda doing but once you see all angles its an 05-07 400ex plastics with almost a raptor grill sitting below. I think Honda needs to change a little bit but i look at it as honda made its 1st big bore sport qaud so give it time. Honda basically started sport quads with the 400ex and then the sport really grew with 4 strokes. As of now though I deffinately like the raptor way better. IRS doesnt impress me much and seems to take away the sporty look or thought of it IMO. Raptor is nice and alway has been.
hey there... honda started sport quads with the 2 fiddy r, not the 400ex i would take an r over an ex anyday.
Posted by: TheNewn
The 250R did not start the sport quad industry. It was not the first 250 2 stroke quad out, pretty sure that goes to the LT250r, Suzuki.
Suzuki probably 'started' high performance atv's. And honda REstarted it, with the 400EX.
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