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Crank Bearing Failure
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Posted by: GEARSMOKER

hey guys! got a 04 450r, and i think the crank bearing went out. a lot of shavings in the oil, then it seized itself up. just wondering if anyone out there put together a step by step manual on how to fix that yourself. i've seen some pretty good tutorials with pics on here before, just wondering if anyone knew of any. thanks for any help.

Posted by: MixMasterMike

this is a pretty tough thing to fix. usually when that crank goes almost everything goes from what ive read on it. How many hours you have on your 450 and what kind of oil did you run? how often did you change your oil AND oil filter? just trying to get a look at how many hours i may have left untill im out of commission

Posted by: GEARSMOKER

the quad had 2 hard seasons of xc racing here in michingan. changed the oil and filter pretty religiously every 2 races. used synthetic honda oil and honda filters.

Posted by: MixMasterMike

quote:
Originally posted by GEARSMOKER
the quad had 2 hard seasons of xc racing here in michingan. changed the oil and filter pretty religiously every 2 races. used synthetic honda oil and honda filters.

did you use synthetic oil? thats what I run

Posted by: GEARSMOKER

yep,sure did

Posted by: MixMasterMike

quote:
Originally posted by GEARSMOKER
yep,sure did

bummer man. u gonna go to a 480 now or what? Id look into that ice company that is rebuilding engines

Posted by: Donjuan54

Do alot of 450 owners not know that the cranks are bad? Man it pisses me off when i look on the section and see new threads of 450 crank bearing causing the motor to be junk. Good luck with your rebuild.

Posted by: wvspeedfreak

quote:
Originally posted by Donjuan54
Do alot of 450 owners not know that the cranks are bad? Man it pisses me off when i look on the section and see new threads of 450 crank bearing causing the motor to be junk. Good luck with your rebuild.

Let me ask this.If you have a perfectly good running 04-05 450r would you disassemble the engine and replace the crank bearings and or crank assembly before you have problems?According to the poll posted it seems like about 1 in 10 has a failure.It seems to me that there is very little warning before these things do major damage and when they do it costs way more than if you would just correct it in advance.(assuming it is out of warranty).

Posted by: honda350r

Honda has made the right bearing, part of the crank and you can no longer buy just the right bearing, If your bearing is bad and want to buy a bearing you have to buy a crank to get it!.. Bummer

Go look it up on Service Honda and you will see no part number for that bearing!!

I have bought that bearing before Honda changed and I am going to order it and see if I get the right side crank bearing seperate ..

Posted by: BSTURDIVANT

Replace crankshaft after 1 hard season! Crank bearings are separate and don't come with crank!

Posted by: Shawn H

I agree thats what I do!

Posted by: compedge

The crankshaft is on back order. ive heard that they are redisgning the crank bearing. The bearing is now part of the crank and not the rod. my crank is coming in sometime in march.

Posted by: honda350r

quote:
Originally posted by BSTURDIVANT
Replace crankshaft after 1 hard season! Crank bearings are separate and don't come with crank!

Go to your dealer or service honda and find out for yourself! The right bearing is now part of the crank and not sold seperate !!

Posted by: GEARSMOKER

its just's a bummer that these things are made sub-par from the factory. i mean, why put maching out with these probems from the get go? just trying to get a litte knowledge from you guys, let me know if you have any suggestions.

Posted by: BSTURDIVANT

We must have bought one of the last before redsign! About 1 month ago!

Posted by: BSTURDIVANT

Service Honda still shows it separate-91008-Hp1-671 bearing
13000-HP1-670 crank.

Posted by: clutt225

My motor seemed fine but I thought for a 80$ gasket kit I would check it out. The con rod at the piston is f'ed the right main bearing has spun at some point. Long expensive story short, crank is being rebuilt by falicon, cylinder is geting re finished, geting a new piston wiseco 11.5:1. and if this thing dosn't stay together I will part it out and never buy another honda.

Posted by: honda350r

This is the new crank # 13090-HP1-315

Service Honda is not updated,but you may be able to purchase that bearing if you have the # ..

Posted by: honda350r

crankshaft with bearing

Posted by: DEAL

What years and serial #s does this crank bearing failure effect?

Posted by: BSTURDIVANT

Mostly early 05, looks like the inner race is now part of the crank!

Posted by: DEAL

quote:
Originally posted by BSTURDIVANT
Mostly early 05, looks like the inner race is now part of the crank!

My quad has been raced for 2 years, it is an early 04 model,
How much of a risk do I run?

Posted by: BSTURDIVANT

High!!

Posted by: clutt225

Get a gasket kit and be sure. You are riding a time bomb and it could cost a lot more if you wait.

Posted by: DEAL

what do i need to order to fix this problem then.

Posted by: clutt225

Calm down you don't even know that you have the problem yet.
Get a gasket kit tear the motor down. look very close at the oil left in the cases, mine was full of metalic dust. Check the wrist pin for play or scoring of any sort. Pull the crank and check to see if the main bearing has sliped ar shows any signs that don't look quite right. check to see if you have scratches in the cylinder.
Mine had all of this. I am having falicon rebuild my crank with the knife rod, My cylinder is geting new nikasil coating, and the piston is being replaced wiseco 11.5:1. Its not going to be cheap but it will be strong.

Posted by: DEAL

The top end of my motor was rebuilt in august, and at the time the guy had no intent to sell it, so if anything was wrong with it I'm sure he would have replaced it.
It was only ridden for a month or so then put away till the start of December when I bought it.

Posted by: MixMasterMike

id say your fine DEAL...mine has a ton of hours and its still going strong. If i see metal in my oil or oil filter then ill be scared

Posted by: JW450R1

i was just to honda today.talked to a honda tech,and he said he really didn't see may bearing falures on 04-05 r's.some of the questions he asked were how much did they change there oil.
also how much did they clean there air filter.
he said that every moto u should change air filter.
and change oil every race....
can we get some feed back on the bearing failures on when and how much did they change there oil's and filters....

Posted by: compedge

Mine had 6 hours on it with one filter and oil change. I had a lot of scratches on the inside of the race on that side of the bearing. I was going to order a new race but know I know why I cant find a part #. The new crank is a much better design. I halso heard the rod bearing is now part of the crank. Im waiting for the new crank. Ive found used ones but im not ganna chance it.
And I dont want to spend extra $ on the falicon.

Posted by: compedge

I believe this is the part # BEARING
91008-HP1-672 $43.96

Posted by: Eric_Winkworth

I'm just going back and fourth from buying a 20 year old 250R or a year used 450R. After reading this thread i'm thinking 250R. My friends cousins both ride 250R's one is a 87 and the other an 88. They seriously have kicked the livin crap out of there bikes, and although there has been times when they quads where stripped right down for powdercoating and a fresh top end. They have never seen any crank work. They have raced, they have ridden them very very hard. Always using bel ray products.

250R I think that is why they cost more now then they did 20 years ago.

Good luck fixing your crank, glad I'm reading this now!

Posted by: GEARSMOKER

other than a few of these bearing troubles,the 450's are bullet proof. spend the money and get a 450. 250r's were bad ***** in the day,but that's not where it's at nowaday's. trust us.

Posted by: Eric_Winkworth

So you think a 450R with a skilled rider could beat a 250R with a skilled rider?

Posted by: GEARSMOKER

if skill were equal, both quads would be pretty close. but after the race, the 450r owner wouldn't have to rebuild his motor.

Posted by: clutt225

really

Posted by: compedge

04-05 Had a bad rod bearing and main bearing. Once you rebuld your bottom end with the updated crank there shouldent be any more problems.

Posted by: Digsy

I was waiting for a 450 '06 Electric start, but have been offered a good price on a '05 kicker from the same dealership. I was thinking about taking it cos I am only going to dune & desert-trail it.

The machine is still in the box, so should be a late model '05. I won't be looking at performance mods except maybe pipe, jets & filter and don't ride too crazy...

Is it just racers and head-bangers that have seen this problem, or do you guys think its best to leave the '05 and wait?

Digsy...

Posted by: Rich250RRacer

quote:
Originally posted by GEARSMOKER
if skill were equal, both quads would be pretty close. but after the race, the 450r owner wouldn't have to rebuild his motor.

Is this race a year long? I always run a full GNCC season on my 250R and rebuild it during the winter if it needs it or not.

Posted by: trick450r

hmmm i have a very very very early 04' january 10th 2004 i brought it home...anyway i have ridden it hard for the past 2 years and now i remember seeing alittle metallic bits in the oil...i think im gonna change it this week just for sure...but other than that i havn't had many problems, the motor is extrmemely built now so if it blows alot of money is down the drain, what are my chances?

Posted by: BSTURDIVANT

If the metal is on the engine side, you have trouble!

Posted by: chronicareo

trick450 do u still want my corrado? ur pm box is full gimme a call 908-966-7394

Posted by: trick450r

quote:
Originally posted by chronicareo
trick450 do u still want my corrado? ur pm box is full gimme a call 908-966-7394

i might be intrested, but your gonna have to lower the price a bit, IM me at rmotox83r on aim and we'll talk about it...

Posted by: ATC350X 85

quote:
Originally posted by trick450r
hmmm i have a very very very early 04' january 10th 2004 i brought it home...anyway i have ridden it hard for the past 2 years and now i remember seeing alittle metallic bits in the oil...i think im gonna change it this week just for sure...but other than that i havn't had many problems, the motor is extrmemely built now so if it blows alot of money is down the drain, what are my chances?

Thats what I started to see. Im pulling my motor out tomorrow. Id rather catch it now that do catastrophic damage.

Posted by: compedge

Mine showed no sighn its was going. I dont kill this thing or race it. Trail ride lots off woops. A couple laps on the pond with studs and bang 6 hours later. Mine is a 04 that sat for 1 1/2 years.